Is it gamethrowing
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  3. ISO #3

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    If you claim a random role and get lynched but you faction wins anyway
    or if you claim doc day 1?

    Need legit answers from mods only. I'm trying to cut down my gamethrowing here.
    It is gamethrowing based on your intention. Every once in a blue moon I am so certain a player is scum I go and claim "Sheriff" with a night peek even though I am a citizen or a doctor or something. My intention in doing so is to win, to get the town to kill someone I am sure is scum and help my win condition.
    Now is it gamethrowing to troll and just claim nonsense on the stand as town? It sure can be. As long as you play to your win condition and play straight up you dont have to worry about getting a gamethrowing report on you. Its when you start doing goofy stuff that does not make sense that you will get reported.

    Is it gamethrowing to claim doc day 1- If you are a doctor it can be. If you are a veteran not so much. If you are voted up D1 and about to get lynched absolutely not. I can say that I personally would consider pushing gamethrowing on a player that D1 outed themselves as a doctor for no reason.

    For a baseline just think of it this way- Punishments are implemented to help keep players from having to put up with things that are done to ruin their experience. If you try to ruin another players experience chances are that you may get punished. If you do not you will probably never have an issue. In the 1500 or so games I have played I believe I have only been reported 1 time.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  4. ISO #4

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by Helz View Post
    It is gamethrowing based on your intention. Every once in a blue moon I am so certain a player is scum I go and claim "Sheriff" with a night peek even though I am a citizen or a doctor or something. My intention in doing so is to win, to get the town to kill someone I am sure is scum and help my win condition.
    Now is it gamethrowing to troll and just claim nonsense on the stand as town? It sure can be. As long as you play to your win condition and play straight up you dont have to worry about getting a gamethrowing report on you. Its when you start doing goofy stuff that does not make sense that you will get reported.

    Is it gamethrowing to claim doc day 1- If you are a doctor it can be. If you are a veteran not so much. If you are voted up D1 and about to get lynched absolutely not. I can say that I personally would consider pushing gamethrowing on a player that D1 outed themselves as a doctor for no reason.

    For a baseline just think of it this way- Punishments are implemented to help keep players from having to put up with things that are done to ruin their experience. If you try to ruin another players experience chances are that you may get punished. If you do not you will probably never have an issue. In the 1500 or so games I have played I believe I have only been reported 1 time.
    So based on that:

    I know a player whos really, really bad. Like seriously bad, if hes Marshall he just random lynch 3 town.

    Said player picks the same name every game. So I claim sheriff and that hes Mafia to get him lynched. Chances are that hes really an evil role, or if he was town he wouldve likely harmed town.
    --> I didnt do it because I dont like him, but because I think hes either evil or will most likely harm town.
    -----> No gamethrowing

    UNLESS: This guy is a mod of this site, then u will get ruled for gamethrowing anyway

  5. ISO #5

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    I would not say that is appropriate. You cant just go and lynch one specific player every game they are in. Your actions need to be based on reasoning for that specific game because you have reason to believe that in that specific game he is not town. You could either call that Gamethrowing or Griefing but either way it is not acceptable. Not every player will be highly skilled and thats something you have to either accept or put together private games with those you want to play with.

    And any Mods/Admins are held to a much higher standard than normal players. Some people think staff get special treatment but really- if you report staff they get scrutinized much much harder than a normal player would.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  6. ISO #6

  7. ISO #7

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    So is that a yes
    There isn't a 100% clear rule -- it's situational depending on the circumstances and on your intentions. As Helz said, there can be good reasons to lie about your role and bad reasons. If you are getting reported frequently, you're probably pushing things a bit too close for comfort.

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  9. ISO #9

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by Lysergic View Post
    If you are not trying to win, then yes, you're game throwing. That includes intentionally getting lynched.
    Put another way, you should be able to explain in a credible way how your actions are designed to help you achieve your win condition. If you are voted up to trial as a member of the Town, it's typically not a great idea to lie about your role. This isn't a 100% rule, however, and there certainly may be odd situations where it might be beneficial to lie about your role on trial. It just doesn't tend to be a high percentage play if you are Town aligned.

  10. ISO #10

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    If you claim a random role and get lynched but you faction wins anyway
    or if you claim doc day 1?

    Need legit answers from mods only. I'm trying to cut down my gamethrowing here.
    Hey there marine man! I'm not sure if it's gamethrowing, and I'm really not suitable to answer this question! Maybe try asking a mod sometime ^_^
    Love, Goatsecraft

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    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    Claiming a random role to be a dickhead can be misleading though
    This is why we keep saying there's not a bright line rule and it's dependent on how you are conducting yourself. Aside from certain specific crimes like role quitting (you either do it or you don't) or inciting a leave train (ditto), most crimes have an subjective element of intent to them. You have to use your own judgment to determine whether lying about your role is going to help you achieve your win condition. The goal of moderation is not to limit legitimate strategy or micromanage how people play when they are trying to win -- it's to prevent people from deliberately ruining the game for others.

    Not sure there's really much more we can say here. If you are very concerned about game-throwing with they way you play, I'd advise you to play a little more conservatively to start and then gradually refine your strategy as you feel more comfortable taking risks.

  15. ISO #15

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by DarknessB View Post
    This is why we keep saying there's not a bright line rule and it's dependent on how you are conducting yourself. Aside from certain specific crimes like role quitting (you either do it or you don't) or inciting a leave train (ditto), most crimes have an subjective element of intent to them. You have to use your own judgment to determine whether lying about your role is going to help you achieve your win condition. The goal of moderation is not to limit legitimate strategy or micromanage how people play when they are trying to win -- it's to prevent people from deliberately ruining the game for others.

    Not sure there's really much more we can say here. If you are very concerned about game-throwing with they way you play, I'd advise you to play a little more conservatively to start and then gradually refine your strategy as you feel more comfortable taking risks.
    Wait what inciting a leave train is reportable? The save sucks I'm leaving if other ppl leave that's not my fault. Also I thought rolequitting was also just simple point deduction not a reportable offense.

  16. ISO #16

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    Wait what inciting a leave train is reportable? The save sucks I'm leaving if other ppl leave that's not my fault. Also I thought rolequitting was also just simple point deduction not a reportable offense.
    If a save sucks just leave. Dont try to ruin the game spamming "CHOOO CHOOOO" and such. Thats why its called "Inciting a leave train"
    And yes role quitting is reportable. Although its probably the lowest offense there is.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  17. ISO #17

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Yeah, inciting a leave train means trying to get others to leave with you. Again, intent is a big part of what makes it a crime. If you are pissed at the host, so you go out of your way to ruin the game for EVERYONE instead of just quietly leaving, it's breaking a rule. Same with game throwing; intent matters.

  18. ISO #18

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Really this thread makes it sound like you want to find out exactly how much you can get away with without breaking a rule. All I can really say is that we are not robots. We look at each situation for what it is. There is no loop hole to jump through and ruin players experiences.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

  19. ISO #19

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by Helz View Post
    Really this thread makes it sound like you want to find out exactly how much you can get away with without breaking a rule. All I can really say is that we are not robots. We look at each situation for what it is. There is no loop hole to jump through and ruin players experiences.
    You aren't all wrong. I'm just trying to see what the mindset of the mods are in relation to how they will view my actions. I tend to do things very unorthodox. But really banning for leaving sounds like a douche move tbh. Why not ban the guy with the troll save? I'm not trying to play 14 jester 1 sk setup. im just sayin

  20. ISO #20

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    You aren't all wrong. I'm just trying to see what the mindset of the mods are in relation to how they will view my actions. I tend to do things very unorthodox. But really banning for leaving sounds like a douche move tbh. Why not ban the guy with the troll save? I'm not trying to play 14 jester 1 sk setup. im just sayin
    1. Mods don't ban people for leaving. That's a dumb thing and the mods try not to be dumb.

    2. Leaving when a bad save is selected is not punishable under current rules. The rules stop you from leaving when you get a specific role like doctor (multiple replays are required to prove that) and from getting others to leave the game as well. If everyone leaves the game on their own accord, then there's no problem.

    3. The existence of a repick function stops the mods from trying to regulate saves. How could the mods decide which saves were legit and which saves were terrible? It's up to the public to decide what they want to play, and that's why repick exists.

    4. The existence of the on-hold/watch-list system should prevent automatic banlistings. The mods are human and make mistakes, but they try and uphold the fun of the game for everyone.

    If you are trying to play the game, I wouldn't worry about anything. Besides, now that you have this thread I'm sure a mod would contact you about a replay before they add you to any list.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elixir View Post
    You should be priviledged to experience bestmas.

    "waah the screen is shaking, waah my delicate eyes".

    Fuck sake.

  21. ISO #21

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    You aren't all wrong. I'm just trying to see what the mindset of the mods are in relation to how they will view my actions. I tend to do things very unorthodox. But really banning for leaving sounds like a douche move tbh. Why not ban the guy with the troll save? I'm not trying to play 14 jester 1 sk setup. im just sayin
    Dude, read what we are posting.

    We don't ban you for leaving a game. The rule is about people who intentionally try to get EVERYONE to leave the lobby (like shouting "LEAVE TRAIN LOLOLOL!" right before names, naming yourself CHOOO CHOOO, and then quitting, with everyone else following).

    We also don't ban right away after one report for like... ANYTHING other than hacking.

    And we don't punish people for doing bad setups because you can repick hosts. Hosts can't even start the game for like 15-20 seconds after lobby start so that people have time to repick. And even after they start, there's a countdown where you can still repick.

  22. ISO #22

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by Lysergic View Post
    Dude, read what we are posting.

    We don't ban you for leaving a game. The rule is about people who intentionally try to get EVERYONE to leave the lobby (like shouting "LEAVE TRAIN LOLOLOL!" right before names, naming yourself CHOOO CHOOO, and then quitting, with everyone else following).

    We also don't ban right away after one report for like... ANYTHING other than hacking.

    And we don't punish people for doing bad setups because you can repick hosts. Hosts can't even start the game for like 15-20 seconds after lobby start so that people have time to repick. And even after they start, there's a countdown where you can still repick.
    I have another legit question. What is the procedure for people kicking everyone from lobby? There has been quite a few recently.

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    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    I have another legit question. What is the procedure for people kicking everyone from lobby? There has been quite a few recently.
    What do you mean "kicking everyone from the lobby"? Like, one person in a lobby is voting to kick people during the game setup phase?

    Or do you mean in the SC2 lobby, before the game even starts?

  26. ISO #26

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by Lysergic View Post
    What do you mean "kicking everyone from the lobby"? Like, one person in a lobby is voting to kick people during the game setup phase?

    Or do you mean in the SC2 lobby, before the game even starts?
    Yes the pregame lobby. Also not just kicking 1 guy I mean kicking every single person that comes in
    Last edited by marinebase7; December 15th, 2015 at 08:01 PM.

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  29. ISO #29

    Re: Is it gamethrowing

    Quote Originally Posted by marinebase7 View Post
    Yes the pregame lobby. Also not just kicking 1 guy I mean kicking every single person that comes in
    The reason we can not do anything about that even if we wanted to is simply because anyone can make an account and name themselves after a player. Screen shots can be faked and even if you had video of them doing it we can not specifically identify that players SC-ID. All you can do in that situation is work with blizzard on it. We are not blizzard staff and we have no control over what people do outside of the actual game.
    Intellectual growth comes from discussions, not arguments. If you are unwilling to change your position and hear the other persons side you are closed minded and wasting your time.
    If you can not clearly explain what the other sides reasoning is you can not disagree with their position because you do not understand it.

 

 

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