S-FM 153: Illuminati

[MattZed]

Im pretty sure town would have lost if we misslynched Slaol and firebringer decided to become the new Godfather.

That would have been town's first mislynch in a game where they had done two no-lynches and the neutral scumsided. With the Masons in play, scum didn't have too many places to hide, which is why I think the way I did it made the game hard for scum.

[SuperJack]

Gussed both Mafia correctly. Lol.

[Firebringer]

Its sad they both got lynched because they made claims. They were ballsy, if they knew what the setup actually looked like they wouldve known to claim citizen but they went for gold on that.

I gotta give them both props for that.

Except for Darkness claim on sheriff, the people he checked were to convenient, I know he was going for us mislynching a mason, but honestly he would get lynched the next day for that claim.

I guess he was going for me siding with scum later?

Sekov doctor claim was alright in my book. I mean, there was no real confirmation that death/stealth was doctor.

[MattZed]

Illuminati 2.0 is going to be a 13-player Large S-FM where, if there is an Illuminati, at least one mason(if there are masons) and one mafia are in it. There will never be a non-Illuminati Mayor in an Illuminati setup.

This will be my far superior version of the Mason/Cult setups.

[Numbertwo]

Its sad they both got lynched because they made claims. They were ballsy, if they knew what the setup actually looked like they wouldve known to claim citizen but they went for gold on that.

I gotta give them both props for that.

Except for Darkness claim on sheriff, the people he checked were to convenient, I know he was going for us mislynching a mason, but honestly he would get lynched the next day for that claim.

I guess he was going for me siding with scum later?

Sekov doctor claim was alright in my book. I mean, there was no real confirmation that death/stealth was doctor.

I thought it was suspicious that he claimed to heal cryptonic N1 when cryptonic wasn't even in the game night 1.

[SuperJack]

After Darknesss role list assumptions labelling Sekov as Consig. That's what put him at top of my list. Along with his on and off voting on me.

[SuperJack]

Quote below of my LW.

I suspect Fire bringer to shoot one of us in the claim we are not masons.

As you can see, we are both masons. And this is deffinetly setup A. (Unless you think we would lynch the Godfather illuminate. Which at this point your going extremely farfetched)

Now. DarknessB roles GF. We were very lucky to get this lynch. As it leaves 1 more mafia to get.

Let's start off with Darkness.
He claims Sekov? is Consiglere in each of his role list assumptions. This could be him claiming the truth in hope it's an illuminate game. Or just wifom it.
Or he was forced to choose him as mafia since his fake sheriff didn't check hin

Next target is RVLG. Attempting to switch the train to Crypt. And voting me earlier. Although he has been strong and active in the day chat. Claimed innocent by fake darkness sheriff claim.

And then Slaol. Unsusal buggern with interactions with Darkness since the start, did he hammer his team mate to seem more town? Knowing that no one else was unvoting.

I believe crypt is innocent. Along with the obvious number 2 and fire.

The only issue I have is if firebeinger remembers as either amnesiac or jester. Since we will have no way to prove either of them. Survivor would be perfect.

[Darkcrusader]

To be fair, even of B killed someone N1, we still would have lost, I was 50-50 on making a citi vs doc claim, I thought people would question 3 citi claims vs a random one xD, that's why I claimed doc. Also yeah it was my mistake that I said Crypt not Darkestlight, I thought he was replaces by the Darkestlgith then came back to the game .

[Darkcrusader]

Gussed both Mafia correctly. Lol.

No you didn't xD. Slalom found DarknessB on day one and kept on trying to hammer him. It was over since it even began and after that it was just a mess. Even if I would have been able to lynch him, then kill another guy, I was next, mason was out of the table, then it was either RL and Crypt the remaining citi claims.

[Darkcrusader]

-vote Slalom

I'd say for MVP, if it wasn't for him, they wouldn't have found both B and me. But srsly that fucking lucky lynch, first terminator random shot, now random first day accusation that found the GF xD

[SuperJack]

Lol. That Day1 vote from Slaol is not the reason Darkness was lynched. And you outed yourself with the Doctor claim and slip with naming crypt.

[Slaol]

-vote Slalom

I'd say for MVP, if it wasn't for him, they wouldn't have found both B and me. But srsly that fucking lucky lynch, first terminator random shot, now random first day accusation that found the GF xD

I mean. Nothing was luck.
Sister needed to die.
Darkness was too friendly, scum.
You slipped.
I'm like Captain Kirk man, i run solely on gut.

Also told Fire we were in an illuminatiless game on day 1 as Citizen. Only so many things can be luck before something more is going on man.

[DarknessB]

LOL, this game turned on two moments -- SuperJack's lynch train stopping at L-1 and Slaol's lynch train stopping at L-1. Either one of those goes differently and there's a whole different game that might have played out.

As MattZed points out, this setup was VERY difficult for the Mafia given we didn't even know if we could trust each other. Having two Masons made it very difficult as well because a decent size chunk of the Town was going to be confirmed once it was obvious there were not Illuminati. Also, even if we had killed someone on n1, the fact that Fire was a pretty pro-Town Neutral didn't help out our case. Had Fire been more devious, this could have actually been a LYLO situation -- Slaol is lynched, Fire converts to GF, Numbertwo is night killed. That leaves Crypt and RLVG vs. Fire and Sekov -- a Mafia win.

So yeah, this was a frustrating first game as Mafia, lol. It wasn't quite as lopsided as it looked -- given the two L-1s mentioned above. What didn't help as well were the large number of lurkers / replacements. I feel like I got dinged in large part because I went along with Fire's proposed lynch of SuperJack. Had I lurked more, I wouldn't have been a target for SuperJack to launch a counter train on. Lesson learned -- lurk more as scum.

[Darkcrusader]

Lol. That Day1 vote from Slaol is not the reason Darkness was lynched. And you outed yourself with the Doctor claim and slip with naming crypt.

In a way it was because he kept pushing a Darkness lynch. I couldn't claim much xD except doc or citi, and with already 3 other citi claim and me sleeping while Darkness got hammered I was going to die next because of the late claim.
I've only had one small chance as a doc and Firbringer nailed me .

[DarknessB]

LOL, the fact that everyone other than Deathworlds ended being a Mason or Citizen didn't help either. Both of us should have probably just claimed Citizen but we were going for broke. Didn't work out, alas.

[Darkcrusader]

I should have killed you N1 xD

[DarknessB]

I should have killed you N1 xD

LOL, yeah -- this is exactly why Mafia was at a big disadvantage. The Illuminati paranoia bought the Town some time and fact that it was 2 Masons vs. a Mayor gave them critical mass to push for lynches. I give SuperJack and Numbertwo a lot of credit. Sure, same number of votes, but at least with the Mayor, there's one more person in the game who could have been scum. Could have also offered the Mayor more easily than 2 Masons over 2 nights.

I don't necessary understand why Firebringer changed his votes (probably some YOLO type deal), but SJ and N2 managed to hold off the wrong lynches until trains could get flipped. At the end of the day, it's a game of inches and we came up short. Too bad not even DR could get Slaol lynched. Also, I noticed that the failed lynches tended to occur around overnight US time, which didn't help out case. If only Crypt had been around to hammer Slaol...

[SuperJack]

You should of shot number two as soon as he revealed.
Tbh what first caught me onto you was that you lurked more then normal to me.

[Cryptonic]

I liked everyone giving me overviews of what happened before I replaced it.
It gave good reads and showed how other people viewed the game.

[Cryptonic]

I also like how I went to bed without voting, and woke up to a victory.

[DarknessB]

You should of shot number two as soon as he revealed.
Tbh what first caught me onto you was that you lurked more then normal to me.

Suppose it was Setup C though? At that point, I knew that I wasn't Illuminati but I had no idea about Sekov, and it would have been pretty troll to think MattZed would run an Illuminati-themed game without any Illuminati. That led me to think that Sekov was more likely Illuminati than not to start. Combined with the Mason reveal, it seemed to be going toward Setup C for a while. In that case, it would have made sense that the Town-aligned Mason would reveal vs. the Illuminati one, which made Numbertwo slightly more believable than you. You also claimed that you weren't a Mason, which no one seemed to flag as suspicious when you changed your story later, lol.

If it was Setup C, shooting Numbertwo (potentially a Town Mason) would have thinned the non-Illuminati numbers down for no reason -- would have gone from a 3v6 to a 3v5 and no way to confirm whether we just killed the Town Mason or the Illuminati one (given MattZed didn't set up the game to reveal Illuminati upon death). The Illuminati vs. non-Illuminati game issue didn't help from the Mafia's point of view at all, especially as the Town had a lot of confirmable roles like you guys as Masons.

Lastly, in terms of "lurking", I was actually out most of the day where the lynch train turned on me, so that was just bad luck rather than situational play. It actually happened during Terminator as well -- sometimes you get lucky, sometimes you don't. I also think that your lynch train and Slaol's both occurring late at night U.S. time was unfortunate too. We just needed one more vote to pull the trigger in each case. The timing lull resulted in people like Fire getting antsy and starting to flip their votes.

[Cryptonic]

Suggesting to kill Numbertwo and reading Sekov's reaction would've been good, though.

[DarknessB]

I also like how I went to bed without voting, and woke up to a victory.

I was rather disappointed that we did not get more exposure to S-FM Batman in this game. When Fire wasn't posting with his results, I had previously joked that we should swap him out for Crypt.

[Cryptonic]

Batman is reserved for special circumstances.

[DarknessB]

Batman is reserved for special circumstances.

Noted -- I'd like to presign for any game with Batman then.

[Darkcrusader]

Oh boy, too bad John Cena wasn't lynched, everyone that would have tried to get him would just get pinned down in mere seconds. He won the game du duuu duu du duuu du.

[DarknessB]

I also like how I went to bed without voting, and woke up to a victory.

Comparatively, I went to bed with Slaol at L-1, one vote away from a mislynch and potential Amnesiac conversion to GF with night kill = Mafia win, and woke up to a loss, lol. Fucking Fire and his lynch train swings.

[SuperJack]

Fire would of still got a reading from NumberTwo. So if he was town, you just shoot the other mason if he reveals, if not, force the other check upon your teammate.

[DarknessB]

Oh boy, too bad John Cena wasn't lynched, everyone that would have tried to get him would just get pinned down in mere seconds. He won the game du duuu duu du duuu du.

We'd have to be able to see him in order to lynch him, sekov -- that's a major issue. I guess his time is now?

[SuperJack]

The train on me appeared whilst I slept also.

And if I was their to reply to your sheriff claims, I would discount them because doctor, sheriff and 2 mason is way to OP for town.

[DarknessB]

The train on me appeared whilst I slept also.

And if I was their to reply to your sheriff claims, I would discount them because doctor, sheriff and 2 mason is way to OP for town.

You had Numbertwo to stick up for you, who was up later that night if I recall. He successfully managed to push back the lynch train until the next day. If he hadn't been as loud, we might have got that final vote on you and it's a whole different game. In contrast, when I was getting lynched, Sekov was asleep. Time zone differences -- live by the sword, die by the sword.

Also, Death was never actually confirmed as Doctor, lol. Could have been lying to take a bullet. But sure, I suppose both of us (Sekov and me) could have claimed Citizen, and maybe things would have gone differently. Who knows though? You guys seemed to have Fire eating out of your hand by midgame. Given it was clearly Setup A by then, I'm surprised Fire didn't go more maverick as he likes to do. That last second Amnesiac --> GF would have been great. Fire is too much of a pro-town Neutral for his own good sometimes, much like in the FM where it got him targeted by all the scum -- oh well.

[Darkcrusader]

Spoiler : sekov's Last Will :

Btw, best lw, gg no re. There should also be and award for best lw in the game.
Edit: Good nite sweet prence, mey ur memes be barried with you xoxox

[DarknessB]

Spoiler : sekov's Last Will :

Btw, best lw, gg no re. There should also be and award for best lw in the game.
Edit: Good nite sweet prence, mey ur memes be barried with you xoxox

There's a certain elegance to dropping the Watermeloann copypasta. That should have resulted in good karma and us winning the game alone.

[Darkcrusader]

There's a certain elegance to dropping the Watermeloann copypasta. That should have resulted in good karma and us winning the game alone.

They had no right to lynch me lol I sexually identify as doctor, therefore I am town.

[DarknessB]

They had no right to lynch me lol I sexually identify as doctor, therefore I am town.

We got a raw deal man, but good to be Mafia with you. The Illuminati uncertainty made us paranoid toward each other, which cost us a n1 kill (my bad). After that, the two Mason reveal was too strong to overcome and Fire didn't muck up the works as much as a Neutral as I would have hoped. We probably screwed up by not just claiming Citizen on our role claims, but so it goes -- even that might not have saved us. Assuming CT wasn't going to help us, it really was a 2-7 with two pretty decently confirmed townies and a well-protected / dangerous CT (gun, vest, etc.). Was definitely an uphill fight based on the game setup. At least we had fun in night chat though -- I hope you all enjoyed reading that, lol.

I figured that MattZed would have wanted to play off all the inter-faction conflicts that Setup C had -- i.e. GF vs. Consig, Mason vs. Mason. Would have made for a more interesting game IMO with trust dynamics flying all over the place. As it was, the only trust dynamic was between the Mafia which delayed us on that n1 kill. Once the Illuminati paranoia ended, it turned out to be a town steamroll, even if just by one vote each time. Even if we killed someone n1, I think the outcome would have been the same though, as they Town would have figured that an aggressive Mafia was a sign that it wasn't an Illuminati game.

[Darkcrusader]

We got a raw deal man, but good to be Mafia with you. The Illuminati uncertainty made us paranoid toward each other, which cost us a n1 kill (my bad). After that, the two Mason reveal was too strong to overcome and Fire didn't muck up the works as much as a Neutral as I would have hoped. We probably screwed up by not just claiming Citizen on our role claims, but so it goes -- even that might not have saved us. Assuming CT wasn't going to help us, it really was a 2-7 with two pretty decently confirmed townies. Was definitely an uphill fight based on the game setup. At least we had fun in night chat though -- I hope you all enjoyed that reading, lol.

Yeah it was nice playing with you too man, you know except being at each other's throats part xD and me threatening to kill you and such. Also it's no problem that you haven't killed anyone N1, the chances were kinda against us even with Firebringer siding with the town , well neutrals be neutral.
Also wow, the entire time we were at the night chat we fucking spent so much time chit chatting xD

[Darkcrusader]

I'm sad that there was no illuminati though, the name of the game is now ironic and doesn't fit the game.

[DarknessB]

Yeah it was nice playing with you too man, you know except being at each other's throats part xD and me threatening to kill you and such. Also it's no problem that you haven't killed anyone N1, the chances were kinda against us even with Firebringer siding with the town , well neutrals be neutral.
Also wow, the entire time we were at the night chat we fucking spent so much time chit chatting xD

I mean, it should have probably been Setup C (from my perspective) or Setup B (from your perspective). I think MattZed has even said that he didn't think the Mafia would have been as suspicious of each other as he would have thought. Building in a "Mafia can kill Illuminati Mafia" dynamic didn't help in that regard. I'm happy that we got within one vote of a mislynch twice and if we had lynched Slaol, we had a real shot with Fire potentially converting to GF and instantly getting us the win. As I said, it's a game of inches ultimately with a lot of random factors playing in, like when lynch trains are started, peoples' schedules, etc. It was fun even with getting destroyed by a bunch of Masons, lol.

[DarknessB]

I'm sad that there was no illuminati though, the name of the game is now ironic and doesn't fit the game.

Crypt did joke in the setup thread that everyone in the game should be Illuminati, but we'd all just not know it. I guess MattZed went for the reverse?

[Cryptonic]

Crypt did joke in the setup thread that everyone in the game should be Illuminati, but we'd all just not know it. I guess MattZed went for the reverse?

maybe we all WERE illuminati

[DarknessB]

maybe we all WERE illuminati

That's true -- maybe we have an unreliable narrator as host (an Illuminati maybe?) who reported a false game outcome to us in order to hide the existence of Illuminati, even in their victory? MattZed, you have some explaining to do...

[Cryptonic]

Maybe we are all illuminati and don't even know it.

[DarknessB]

Maybe we are all illuminati and don't even know it.

In that case, we all won this game together and should all get credit for a win on the ladder.

[DarknessB]

Zekrom, stop being the Hidden Illuminati and lurking on this thread. The game is over now so you can post if you want, lol. It's your chance to counter all of Sekov's allegations from earlier.

[Darkcrusader]

I just found out that Zekrom is actually a legendary pokemon

[Darkcrusader]

lejewndary pokemon*

[Slaol]

i think next game i'm going to decide everything I do with RNG

[Darkcrusader]

Don't upset the RNG gods though.

[acku11]

Faggot, Queer don't even mean what they were supposed to mean anymore, the became derogatory term, and now gay people "claimed them". IDGAF, but still, I disagree with the use of the N word, no matter the race, even if you're black.

Faggot and Queer are my trigga words

[Cryptonic]

As a strong, Jewish, African-American, homosexual man, I am not offended by any of this.