Day 6: The Boiling Rock

[FM Spy]

Wait...the Neutral Evils only have to "Survive to see" certain other roles eliminated. It's possible they might be able to be lynched afterwards for a town win.

If a Neutral Evil fulfills its win condition, does the game immediately end, or would the town be able to try and kill them afterwards for a town win?

[FM Goonswarm]

Good Morning Town,
first of all let me explain this:


it was only a question. imo town shouldn't have to deal with afks (even if only one day, unless there's a good reason). by this you encourage afking as scum tactic. afks/lynching afks should not be part of the game




then we obviously need to face the truth:
- goon is consort because we trust crimson
- thus monster is town/hama
- falsetruth is combustion man obviously spreeing his own house because If you are attacked you will kill the attacker and Spree at your own house.
- narks is a liar and probably hama
- we cannot lynch today
- we got real "unlucky" the townie was modkilled but not the consort
- we already lost because of the last 2 points

"oh well"

[FM FalseTruth]

Except that I'm not Combustion Man.

The whole scene makes no sense at all to me.

From YapYap's LW:
"... On N5, I shot FalseTruth because I think he got disguised as by Auckmid. I find it hard to believe that someone who posted explicitly about making a probable code that isn't gibberish would take the UPC code of some catnip brand."

If she didn't like the code she could have said something in thread about it. There wasn't anything wrong with my code, in fact no one would have been able to break it. To shoot someone because you hate their choice of codes is idiotic. YapYap's not an idiot. Something's very wrong with that Last Will.

Then there's Aang. When Aang visits someone they get a power, right? They get feedback:
"Avatar: Avatar Aang himself met you last night, revealing his disguise to be (player), and inspiring you to act in new and more driven ways. Your new role is [role card feedback]
Avatar: You were attacked tonight, but your team's unity kept you safe.
Avatar: You spent a long night meditating, and found a new power within yourself! Your new role is [role card feedback]"

I never got any feedback.

All actions happen simultaneously. I would have been shot by Yap, I would have been given a power by Aang, and they would have died by fire.

But I never got any feedback at all, not last night or during any point in the game. I've been ignored.

They weren't anywhere near me last night, nor was Combustion Man.

I don't know what's going on.

[FM Ozymandias]

FT, kills happen before Avatar and Iroh visits. So you killed Aang before you could get that feedback.

[FM Severn]

if you were the guy with the cap walmart barcode, i think that was retarded too. code aren't supposed to be random like that, they're supposed to make sense according to some pattern. also, you LEFT OUT NUMBERS. which does NOT help your case in that sense. and is there a role that changes last wills?

[FM Severn]

anyone wanna do a best case numbers check to see if town can even win? and what is happening to the lack of mafia kills?

[FM S.A.S.Cnl.Alpha]

Except that I'm not Combustion Man.

The whole scene makes no sense at all to me.

From YapYap's LW:
"... On N5, I shot FalseTruth because I think he got disguised as by Auckmid. I find it hard to believe that someone who posted explicitly about making a probable code that isn't gibberish would take the UPC code of some catnip brand."

If she didn't like the code she could have said something in thread about it. There wasn't anything wrong with my code, in fact no one would have been able to break it. To shoot someone because you hate their choice of codes is idiotic. YapYap's not an idiot. Something's very wrong with that Last Will.

What Ozy said, plus: What the shit could be wrong with that last will? It reflects the last actions and thoughts of that player. Obviously if the Last Will says that Yayap went to shoot you then that's what was actually tried at night. If firescum have a framer that might be possible but it's suuuuper unlikely they would write such a last will, especially since they couldn't have known that Yayap would die tonight.

[FM S.A.S.Cnl.Alpha]

Also the catnip code seems to me like Ozai googling the codes and seeing what he can come up with.

[FM Ozymandias]

Also the catnip code seems to me like Ozai googling the codes and seeing what he can come up with.

That's kind of what I thought originally, too. But again, FT is accused of being MM, not Ozai. If FT is Ozai, then Yayap's vig shot should have killed him, and the MM would have went on his spree at Yayap's house, and Zack would have been giving Yayap a power. But then FT would be dead. Him being Combustion Man and the code just being a bad code makes more sense.

anyone wanna do a best case numbers check to see if town can even win? and what is happening to the lack of mafia kills?

I mean, it depends on what happens tonight, and also depends on whether or not Ozai lived.

It's not looking good for town at this point, though.

[FM Ozymandias]

S.A.S., how many cabbages?

[FM FalseTruth]

if you were the guy with the cap walmart barcode, i think that was retarded too. code aren't supposed to be random like that, they're supposed to make sense according to some pattern. also, you LEFT OUT NUMBERS. which does NOT help your case in that sense. and is there a role that changes last wills?

No, the idea was that we posted a code that could be verified. Harz products are very popular in the US. Every major retailer carries them. They're in your local grocery store. It was a great code.

My second choice of code was reversing zip codes for 2 small towns.

[FM S.A.S.Cnl.Alpha]

S.A.S., how many cabbages?

1, got one last night.

And yeah, just threw my thought about Ozai out there.

[FM S.A.S.Cnl.Alpha]

No, the idea was that we posted a code that could be verified. Harz products are very popular in the US. Every major retailer carries them. They're in your local grocery store. It was a great code.

My second choice of code was reversing zip codes for 2 small towns.

Wouldn't you say a code that requires your own unique train of thought to solve might be much better? A code like catnip product code just requires the ability to look up. And since it can be found online, how secure could it be?

[FM FalseTruth]

FT, kills happen before Avatar and Iroh visits. So you killed Aang before you could get that feedback.

I didn't kill him.

And how could someone be killed before they visit?

This game confuses me.

[FM Severn]

zipcode is the same level of bad, but worse. unless those zip codes related to each other in a more specific way. thats the pattern that we'd be looking for, and extremely hard to crack.

[FM FalseTruth]

Wouldn't you say a code that requires your own unique train of thought to solve might be much better? A code like catnip product code just requires the ability to look up. And since it can be found online, how secure could it be?

Everything in your house has a UPC code on it. Now what are the odds that two players would grab a bag of catnip and read that code? (Or look up that product code online?)

[FM Severn]

Everything in your house has a UPC code on it. Now what are the odds that two players would grab a bag of catnip and read that code? (Or look up that product code online?)

what makes it easy is that given those numbers, i could have googled it, and/or reversed the numbers and googled it. viola, i have a list of random things that i could say was my code. anyway we're not discussing whether you're ozai and have a badly cracked code. we're discussing whether or not your MM.

[FM Ozymandias]

I didn't kill him.

And how could someone be killed before they visit?

This game confuses me.

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...ossible-Roles)

Scroll down to "Spoiler : OoO :" and expand.

Here it is in case you don't want to leave the thread:

Spoiler : Order of Operations :

1. Captures
a. Jailor Captures
b. Kidnapper Captures

2. Night chats open/interviews occur
a. Architect Invites, Journalist Interviews, Professor Schedules
b. Corrupt Journalist Interviews
c. Hitman Contracts, Infestor Infests, Private Eye Contracts, Student Meets

3. Special Kills
a. Jailor Executes, Veteran Alerts
b. Disguiser Mimics, Kidnapper Executes
c. Doppleganger Disguises
d. Jester Griefs

4. Misdirection & Role blocks
a. Bus Driver Swaps, Enchantress Lure & Repel, Escort Role Blocks, Matchmaker Matches, Operator Switches
b. Beguiler Lures, Chauffeur Swaps, Consort Role Blocks
c. Magician Cages/Repels, Witch Manipulates

5. Protection
a. Vests Items, Bodyguards Guard, Doctor Heals, Survivalist Survives
b. Sadist Follows, Stalker Stalks

6. Miscellaneous
a. Technician Preps/Unpreps
b. Arsonist Preps/Unpreps, Blackmailer Blackmails, Framer Frames
c. Phoenix King Preps/Unpreps, Crown Princess Charges

7. Kill Assists
a. Arms Dealers Equip, Tailors Dress
b. Surgeons Malpractice

8. Kills
a. Gun Items, Bodyguard, Technician, Vigilante
b. Fire Nation Factional Kill, Associate, Bruiser, Disguiser
c. Phoenix King, Butcher, Crown Princess, Mass Murderer, Overlord, Parolee, Toxicologist

9. Investigation
a. Coroner Autopsies, Detective Tracks, Lookout Watches, Sheriff Checks
b. Consigliere Inspects, Mortician Autopsies, Thief Robs, Tracker Tracks/Watches
c. Lawyer Investigates, Locksmith Burglarizes, Private Eye Inspects
d. Truthseer senses

10. Miscellaneous 2 (post kills)
a. Armorsmith Armors, Blacksmith Arms, Gypsy Curses, Nurse Prescribes
b. Avatar Meets, Grand Lotus Meets
c. Arms Dealer Arms, Caporegime Retrains, Drug Dealer Drugs, Mortician Gathers Items, Thief Steals Items
d. Chemist Plants, Parolees Gather Arms, Toxicologists Demand, Ventriloquist Possesses

11. Conversions
a. Overlord Controls

That's the order of operations, explaining what order actions happen in.

Each number section happens at the same time.

So, for example, if a Mafioso tries to kill an Escort, but the Escort role blocks the Mafioso, the Escort would live. This is because Escort role blocks happen in section 4 "Misdirections and Role Blocks," but kills don't happen until section 8.

[FM FalseTruth]

zipcode is the same level of bad, but worse. unless those zip codes related to each other in a more specific way. thats the pattern that we'd be looking for, and extremely hard to crack.

8693402934

Catnip UPCs are extremely hard to crack too.

[FM Severn]

okay, lets try this FT. what was the purpose of making the code?

[FM Severn]

nah, forget it. i'm dropping it until after the game.

[FM FalseTruth]

https://www.sc2mafia.com/forum/showth...ossible-Roles)

Scroll down to "Spoiler : OoO :" and expand.

Here it is in case you don't want to leave the thread:

Spoiler : Order of Operations :

1. Captures
a. Jailor Captures
b. Kidnapper Captures

2. Night chats open/interviews occur
a. Architect Invites, Journalist Interviews, Professor Schedules
b. Corrupt Journalist Interviews
c. Hitman Contracts, Infestor Infests, Private Eye Contracts, Student Meets

3. Special Kills
a. Jailor Executes, Veteran Alerts
b. Disguiser Mimics, Kidnapper Executes
c. Doppleganger Disguises
d. Jester Griefs

4. Misdirection & Role blocks
a. Bus Driver Swaps, Enchantress Lure & Repel, Escort Role Blocks, Matchmaker Matches, Operator Switches
b. Beguiler Lures, Chauffeur Swaps, Consort Role Blocks
c. Magician Cages/Repels, Witch Manipulates

5. Protection
a. Vests Items, Bodyguards Guard, Doctor Heals, Survivalist Survives
b. Sadist Follows, Stalker Stalks

6. Miscellaneous
a. Technician Preps/Unpreps
b. Arsonist Preps/Unpreps, Blackmailer Blackmails, Framer Frames
c. Phoenix King Preps/Unpreps, Crown Princess Charges

7. Kill Assists
a. Arms Dealers Equip, Tailors Dress
b. Surgeons Malpractice

8. Kills
a. Gun Items, Bodyguard, Technician, Vigilante
b. Fire Nation Factional Kill, Associate, Bruiser, Disguiser
c. Phoenix King, Butcher, Crown Princess, Mass Murderer, Overlord, Parolee, Toxicologist

9. Investigation
a. Coroner Autopsies, Detective Tracks, Lookout Watches, Sheriff Checks
b. Consigliere Inspects, Mortician Autopsies, Thief Robs, Tracker Tracks/Watches
c. Lawyer Investigates, Locksmith Burglarizes, Private Eye Inspects
d. Truthseer senses

10. Miscellaneous 2 (post kills)
a. Armorsmith Armors, Blacksmith Arms, Gypsy Curses, Nurse Prescribes
b. Avatar Meets, Grand Lotus Meets
c. Arms Dealer Arms, Caporegime Retrains, Drug Dealer Drugs, Mortician Gathers Items, Thief Steals Items
d. Chemist Plants, Parolees Gather Arms, Toxicologists Demand, Ventriloquist Possesses

11. Conversions
a. Overlord Controls

That's the order of operations, explaining what order actions happen in.

Each number section happens at the same time.

So, for example, if a Mafioso tries to kill an Escort, but the Escort role blocks the Mafioso, the Escort would live. This is because Escort role blocks happen in section 4 "Misdirections and Role Blocks," but kills don't happen until section 8.

Oh. I thought it was posted somewhere that all Night actions happen simultaneously.

If I were switched with Combustion Man, would I get a feedback PM?

[FM Ozymandias]

@FT: The idea was that the code was something that no one else could guess or discover by Google-fu, and was also something that would simultaneously confirm you specifically. So Yayap's code being period table elements that spell "Yayap is town" (roughly) is a good code - no one would think of that, and no one could just google that sequence of numbers to figure out the answer.

Yours wasn't the only bad code, imo. A few people did math-related codes (severn included, I think) that could probably be figured out by anyone sufficiently well-versed in mathematics (i.e. anyone but me). Gerik had a pretty good code - I doubt anyone could have figured that out without some serious effort.

But it doesn't matter, since we're not talking about whether or not you were disguised.

[FM Ozymandias]

Oh. I thought it was posted somewhere that all Night actions happen simultaneously.

If I were switched with Combustion Man, would I get a feedback PM?

You mean is Bus Driver swapped you to Combustion Man's house?

Yes, you would get feedback. But if Combustion Man alerted, Bus Driver would die.

And since the only confirmed Bus Driver is dead, it's unlikely that you were swapped. The most likely explanation is that you are Combustion Man.

[FM FalseTruth]

okay, lets try this FT. what was the purpose of making the code?

So that no one could impersonate us. Which is why I picked the most far-out thing possible. Standard codes can be easily cracked, some gamer types love cracking codes.

[FM Ozymandias]

This turned out to be a pretty productive day, aside from the fact that we can't lynch and will probably lose.

Hidden Fire Nation - Consort - Goonswarm
Hidden Fire Nation - ??????? - Spy/Severn?

Combustion Man (Mass Murderer) - FalseTruth
Hama (Hidden Neutral Evil) - Narks

[FM FalseTruth]

The most likely explanation is that you are Combustion Man.

Jeez.

I'm an absolute nobody.

If you want you can lynch me tomorrow, as an ordinary Citizen I'm dispensable, I guess.

Combustion Man has to be loving this.

[FM Ozymandias]

Jeez.

I'm an absolute nobody.

If you want you can lynch me tomorrow, as an ordinary Citizen I'm dispensable, I guess.

Combustion Man has to be loving this.

Eh. If tonight goes poorly for town, it won't be the townies Combustion Man has to convince.

And again, the best thing about this setup for town is that Combustion Man, Fire Nation, and Hama can't win together. The scum better start killing each other off soon.

[FM Severn]

This turned out to be a pretty productive day, aside from the fact that we can't lynch and will probably lose.

Hidden Fire Nation - Consort - Goonswarm
Hidden Fire Nation - ??????? - Spy/Severn?

Combustion Man (Mass Murderer) - FalseTruth
Hama (Hidden Neutral Evil) - Narks

how could narks have figured out that ganon was lying? any theories?

[FM Ozymandias]

how could narks have figured out that ganon was lying? any theories?

A few.

For starters, he didn't. Narks "figured out" Ganon was lying because he thought Lookout saw self-visits. Lookout doesn't. It just turned out to be happy coincidence that he was right. Other than that result, Narks hasn't given a good result the rest of the game, and two of his results are patent bullshit.

Beyond that, if Hama is Magician, as many people have speculated (and it seems likely given AscendedOne's result earlier in the game), there could have been some Caging/repelling mechanics that gave Ganon away.

[FM Ozymandias]

Though I will say that on the scale of threats to the town, Hama is pretty much at the bottom until Mafia and Combustion Man are dead.

[Slaol]

Wait...the Neutral Evils only have to "Survive to see" certain other roles eliminated. It's possible they might be able to be lynched afterwards for a town win.

If a Neutral Evil fulfills its win condition, does the game immediately end, or would the town be able to try and kill them afterwards for a town win?

Win conditions end the game except for Cabbage Merchant unless he has his goal of cabbages

[FM Ozymandias]

Hey S.A.S., did you Survive on night 4?

[FM Spy]

So if Iroh AND Jeong Jeong turn up dead, we have to lynch Hama before the last of the Mafia/Combustion Man.

Good to know.

[FM Goonswarm]

Honestly, it was obvious he was lying. I was amazed Ganon didn't get lynched right away.

[Forum Mafia GM]

what happens if all mafs are dead, but hama and combustion man are still alive and one or both of them has met their win con, will game end?

they haven't met their win condition if both are alive.

^^

[FM Severn]

I should be a mod

[FM Crimson]

Honestly, it was obvious he was lying. I was amazed Ganon didn't get lynched right away.

well given the fact everyone decided to go "herp derp lets believe it" when i was shouting for like half of the god damn gameday that its an obvious fakeclaim.

can you really be all that amazed?

[FM Rumpel]

i never trust someone who claim his role and doesnt mention anything else

falsetruth what are your feedbacks

[FM FalseTruth]

i never trust someone who claim his role and doesnt mention anything else

falsetruth what are your feedbacks

I have no feedbacks at all.

[FM Rumpel]

I have no feedbacks at all.

i dont buy your claim

your posts does not seem like citizen

[FM S.A.S.Cnl.Alpha]

Hey S.A.S., did you Survive on night 4?

The night after Ozai died? If so, then yes.

[FM vornksr]

jesus lord
so boring

[FM vornksr]

there is not even a different possible explanation for him not getting any feedback given the few roles we have left
magician cannot explain it, even if FT was caged, yayap would have shot self which he didnt

[FM FalseTruth]

You know what has me the most confused within the theory that I fried Aang and Yap is that Yap was coming to kill me and Aang was coming to give me a nice present.

[FM Severn]

Person A was caged by a magician. Vigilante B attacked A, and Mass Murderer C sat on A.

Would the death description of B mass murderer?
Would magician die?

[FM Severn]

Person A was caged by a magician. Vigilante B attacked A, and Mass Murderer C sat on A.

Would the death description of B be via mass murderer?
Would magician die?

fixed

[FM Ozymandias]

The night after Ozai died? If so, then yes.

Ozai has a 1/3 chance of hitting someone immune then.

[FM Ozymandias]

You know what has me the most confused within the theory that I fried Aang and Yap is that Yap was coming to kill me and Aang was coming to give me a nice present.

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or playing dumb.

If someone tries to attack the MM, he automatically goes on a spree killing at his own house. Anyone visiting the MM dies.

[FM FalseTruth]

I'm referring only to the two visitors - one wanted me dead and the other wanted to give me a power. Very opposite, no?