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Arsonist
April 17th, 2018, 02:16 PM
WARNING: CONTAINS MY OPINION, IT MAY BE DIFFENT FROM YOURS!!!
Hello, this is my last thread, i'll proably return... idk when, after this one, i'll stop making any posts and any replies, so i'll don't respond to any messages in this thread, i'll simply won't look at them and you can't make me mad :D.

So, the discussion starts here: it's a very controversial topic. Many pepole say how bad communist countries are, like pepole are poor and e.t.c.
Are communism is THAT bad? You'll proably say: "Yes, it is", because you watched the fake news or read some unfunny jokes about that.
Let's start discussion with 1st country, that was communist: USSR (United Soviet Socialistic Respubics), the 1st communist party was made by Vladimir Lenin.

Pepole are saying the USSR was the worst country ever made, is that's true?
Let's start: that myth was made during Cold War, so it's the fake news. USA was an enemy of USSR and saying "how bad our enemy is" is the common sense!
It's called "Information Wars", brainwash pepole with fake news to make them aggresive against something. USA lost to USSR... Who is better?
In times of USSR, dollar USD was cheaper, than rouble. 1 rouble was at price of 7$, USSR had better economics, than USA. What's next?
USSR was 1st to reach space, and also they won against Adolf Hitler. Also the things from USSR had high quality, i have an example of soviet quality:
I have a Waffle Maker, that was made in Estonia, that was a part of USSR. No factory, no country, but still works. USSR was great, complared to modern Russia.

China was 2nd country to became communist, it's a bad country?
USA hates China with all it's heart, even through american pepole buy a lot of chinese things: from toys to computers.
China is an overpopulated country and pepole there aren't so rich, because country is overpopulated, but pluses?
China has the 1st place on having millionares, but you'll say "it's because China has 5 times bigger population, than USA", but nobody borns to be a millionare! You should be smart engough to make money and buisness, i'm correct? Also the average IQ in China is <105, that's way more, than in USA and also it's easier to brainwash an amierican, than chinese :blink1:.
What about production? I have an Asus labtop and Huawei phone, engough said. And USA has a lack of production, only a lack of war production, but mostly they buy it.

But... The most controversial country is KNDR (North Korea), what's about it?
You've proably heard about this one, from news, from memes and many many more. But isn't suspictinous, that pepole news sayong about this too much? Let's see.
If you're saying their army is bad and you hate them, why you don't fight against them? Afraid? I see USA afraid of attacking them.
In Russia and China, there's a lot of pepole from North Korea, they still live in North Korea and they're because of buisness trips. Don't heard? Because you're brainwashed.
Why Kim Jong Un is the only fat human in North Korea? He became fat in his colledge days, the food in foreign universitety was unhealthly, that's why he's fat. Others aren't they eat food only from KNDR. In KNDR - there's stuff only from KNDR, they can service themselves, i have to admire that. They're defintely smarter, than USA.
In North Korea, you always can find work, they don't have time on suicidal throughts, unlike their south "friends". They have a chanice to press that red button...

Conclusion:
Aren't that's obvious brainwashing? Did you know there's way more poor capitalist countries, than communist? Well... Communism says: everyone is equal, there's no rich officals and poor citizens.
Everything belongs to leader, he may make country great, but he may be an asshole too. While everyone has equal rights and everything belongs to leader, that's easier to control the country, and if leader has no dirty throughts, he may transform a poor country to a superpower. Communist countries are always based on having highest production rate, as possible. At USSR and modern China, this rate is very high - higher, than in USA! It's an example of good communism usage. It's don't worse, than capitalism at all.

WARNING: THAT'S MY OPINION, IT MAY BE DIFFENT, FROM YOURS!!!
DON'T GET TRIGGERED, THAT'S JUST AN OPINION!!!
AND READ WHOLE TEXT, BEFORE POSTING A REPLY!!!

Bonus - USSR vs modern Russia:




Modern Russia
USSR (in these days)


Territory
17.098,2 km2
Russia + 14 another "SSRs"


Population
145 million, not even half of USA's population
300 million, bigger, than in USA!


Economics
5th worst economy in the whole world
2nd best economy in the whole world


Average payements
Not even close to 1000 - 737$ (on time, i wrote this)
2450$ - 7$ = 1 rouble.

Gyrlander
April 17th, 2018, 03:39 PM
I just urge you to watch videos about Korean defectors, they are very intriguing.

Chalibluefin
April 17th, 2018, 03:59 PM
Oh ffs, another Arsonist thread.

Voss
April 17th, 2018, 04:10 PM
I thought you said you wouldn't post anymore.

also TLDR
Arsonist

Stealthbomber16
April 17th, 2018, 05:31 PM
I thought you said you left? Oh well. It seems you're too childish to actually reply to the thread where I addressed this already, so lets talk here.


WARNING: CONTAINS MY OPINION, IT MAY BE DIFFENT FROM YOURS!!!
Hello, this is my last thread, i'll proably return... idk when, after this one, i'll stop making any posts and any replies, so i'll don't respond to any messages in this thread, i'll simply won't look at them and you can't make me mad :D.
POSTS SINCE ARSONIST QUIT: 10
I'll give this maybe three days. A week at most.


So, the discussion starts here: it's a very controversial topic. Many pepole say how bad communist countries are, like pepole are poor and e.t.c.
Are communism is THAT bad? You'll proably say: "Yes, it is", because you watched the fake news or read some unfunny jokes about that.
Yes, it is. This was discussed in the last thread where you brought up a lot of the same points and didn't refute anything we brought up. This really shouldn't be a discussion tbh because you're just stubbornly refusing to comment on anything we say. You made this very apparent when you said

so i'll don't respond to any messages in this thread, i'll simply won't look at them and you can't make me mad :D
The best way to create a persuasive argument is to actually refute the counterargument. This is pretty basic stuff they teach on schools, but schools are for capitalist pigs, right


Let's start discussion with 1st country, that was communist: USSR (United Soviet Socialistic Respubics), the 1st communist party was made by Vladimir Lenin.

Pepole are saying the USSR was the worst country ever made, is that's true?
Let's start: that myth was made during Cold War, so it's the fake news. USA was an enemy of USSR and saying "how bad our enemy is" is the common sense!
It's called "Information Wars", brainwash pepole with fake news to make them aggresive against something. USA lost to USSR... Who is better?
In times of USSR, dollar USD was cheaper, than rouble. 1 rouble was at price of 7$, USSR had better economics, than USA. What's next?
USSR was 1st to reach space, and also they won against Adolf Hitler. Also the things from USSR had high quality, i have an example of soviet quality:
I have a Waffle Maker, that was made in Estonia, that was a part of USSR. No factory, no country, but still works. USSR was great, complared to modern Russia.
Well, let's deal with these in descending order.
First off: nobody here has said the USSR was the worst country ever made. I'd give that honor to something far predating the USSR. Mesopotamia? If you mean recent country, in standards of living terms it's still not in the bottom tiers. I'd place it above various african countries. But I digress. You're quoting things that nobody said.
Second: Just because something was said during a time of war/tension doesn't mean it's fake news. If that's true, this whole thread is a lie because I live in the US and the US is at war with Afghanistan, which was NEAR THE SOVIET UNION ERMAGHERD CUE THE ILLUMINATI MUSIC
Third: Claims that the USSR was more developed is pretty bullshit. Here's a graph.
https://ourworldindata.org/human-development-index
OECD stands for Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development and it includes North America and Europe. I had to google it too, don't worry.
In 1950 the OECD had an average HDI of .42 while eastern europe/russia had .34. That's a stark difference. (For reference, the gap between russia and the next highest region, latin america was also the same size). The gap between the two regions never really got smaller, rather, it stayed about the same for a while before russia began falling due to the collapse of the soviets. As of 2007 the gap was .81 to .54.
At the time, the HDI of .34 was quite good. As of 2015, the lowest HDI of literally any country in the world is .348, and that's Niger.
In fact, according to the table I found (which I sadly cannot find the link to anymore, but it actually having info ends up beating what you're given us so far), the Russian Federation has an HDI of .798, which ties for 50th with Belarus. As for higher HDIs, well, the U.S. is #8, the UK is #14, Japan is #20, France is #22, and Italy is #27. Interestingly, all three of the Baltic countries have a higher HDI than russia, with the lowest being Latvia at #46 (disclaimer, these numbers were up to date as of 2015). So saying that the USA "lost" the cold war is incorrect at best.
EDIT: I found the video I mentioned in the last thread! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8LtQhIQ2AE
Your waffle maker story is great btw, although it's quite irrelevant.
[/COLOR]

China was 2nd country to became communist, it's a bad country?
USA hates China with all it's heart, even through american pepole buy a lot of chinese things: from toys to computers.
China is an overpopulated country and pepole there aren't so rich, because country is overpopulated, but pluses?
China has the 1st place on having millionares, but you'll say "it's because China has 5 times bigger population, than USA", but nobody borns to be a millionare! You should be smart engough to make money and buisness, i'm correct? Also the average IQ in China is <105, that's way more, than in USA and also it's easier to brainwash an amierican, than chinese :blink1:.
What about production? I have an Asus labtop and Huawei phone, engough said. And USA has a lack of production, only a lack of war production, but mostly they buy it.
Well, referring back to the HDI table, china clocks in at #90. The reason China has such high amounts of industry is that it lacks proper education. Most chinese cannot afford to have higher education. Only 27% of chinese citizens actually enroll in tertiary level schooling (think universities) vs the State's 94%.
I found where you got the statement about the Chinese having higher average IQs than Americans, since you didn't actually bother to cite it. While it is true (partially, the average is actually exactly 105, not higher), they're also only #4. The countries they lose to are all Democracies. I think it speaks more to the trend that Asians in general have higher IQ than white-majority countries. But not by a significant margin as you state. The US has an average IQ of 98, while Russia comes in at 97.
Table found at https://iq-research.info/en/average-iq-by-country for those who care to check and draw your own conclusions.
The rest of your points aren't even worth responding to.


But... The most controversial country is KNDR (North Korea), what's about it?
You've proably heard about this one, from news, from memes and many many more. But isn't suspictinous, that pepole news sayong about this too much? Let's see.
If you're saying their army is bad and you hate them, why you don't fight against them? Afraid? I see USA afraid of attacking them.
In Russia and China, there's a lot of pepole from North Korea, they still live in North Korea and they're because of buisness trips. Don't heard? Because you're brainwashed.
Why Kim Jong Un is the only fat human in North Korea? He became fat in his colledge days, the food in foreign universitety was unhealthly, that's why he's fat. Others aren't they eat food only from KNDR. In KNDR - there's stuff only from KNDR, they can service themselves, i have to admire that. They're defintely smarter, than USA.
In North Korea, you always can find work, they don't have time on suicidal throughts, unlike their south "friends". They have a chanice to press that red button...
The acronym is DPRK, not KNDR. Not sure where you heard that.
Your goading comments about the USA not going to war against Korea cannot be answered by me, although my best guess would be the innocent civillians not having actually done anything wrong.
Anyway, I won't even bother answering this portion because I found an Ask-Me-Anything by a North Korean defector who pretty much says the opposite of every point you bring up here. https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/76mm7p/i_am_a_north_korean_defector_who_was_trafficked/


Conclusion:
Aren't that's obvious brainwashing? Did you know there's way more poor capitalist countries, than communist? Well... Communism says: everyone is equal, there's no rich officals and poor citizens.
Everything belongs to leader, he may make country great, but he may be an asshole too. While everyone has equal rights and everything belongs to leader, that's easier to control the country, and if leader has no dirty throughts, he may transform a poor country to a superpower. Communist countries are always based on having highest production rate, as possible. At USSR and modern China, this rate is very high - higher, than in USA! It's an example of good communism usage. It's don't worse, than capitalism at all.
Well, if my assumption is right, and that you actually live in Russia or one of it's neighboring countries (based on your waffle maker story) you might want to take some new English classes but that's beside the point.
The issue is that there really haven't been any "leaders without dirty thoughts" as you so ineloquently put it when it comes to communist countries. Joseph Stalin led a war against Finland (where they actually got slapped around quite a bit lol), Fidel Castro led to the eventual decline of Cuba, the Kim dynasty spreads its own propaganda and is on complete military lockdown, and China has one of the lowest education rates for a country with its HDI.


WARNING: THAT'S MY OPINION, IT MAY BE DIFFENT, FROM YOURS!!!
DON'T GET TRIGGERED, THAT'S JUST AN OPINION!!!
AND READ WHOLE TEXT, BEFORE POSTING A REPLY!!!

Bonus - USSR vs modern Russia:




[COLOR=#00ff00]Modern Russia
USSR (in these days)


Territory
17.098,2 km2
Russia + 14 another "SSRs"


Population
145 million, not even half of USA's population
300 million, bigger, than in USA!


Economics
5th worst economy in the whole world
2nd best economy in the whole world


Average payements
Not even close to 1000 - 737$ (on time, i wrote this)
2450$ - 7$ = 1 rouble.




I actually have no fucking clue where you found any of these facts. Please let me know how you determined Russia to have the 5th worst economy and the USSR to have the 2nd best. Or don't. Some good giggles for me either way.

oops_ur_dead
April 17th, 2018, 08:22 PM
One soviet ruble may have had an official government exchange rate of $7 per. The Soviet government also pinned the value of one soviet ruble to one gram of gold and said that you could exchange it at any time. Obviously neither were ever available to the general public and being caught with US currency meant that you could get arrested and jailed.

Arsonist
April 17th, 2018, 11:46 PM
KNDR = Korean National Democratic Respublic
In my country everyone calls it "KNDR".

Arsonist
April 17th, 2018, 11:47 PM
I thought you said you left? Oh well. It seems you're too childish to actually reply to the thread where I addressed this already, so lets talk here.


[/FONT]POSTS SINCE ARSONIST QUIT: 10
I'll give this maybe three days. A week at most.


Yes, it is. This was discussed in the last thread where you brought up a lot of the same points and didn't refute anything we brought up. This really shouldn't be a discussion tbh because you're just stubbornly refusing to comment on anything we say. You made this very apparent when you said

The best way to create a persuasive argument is to actually refute the counterargument. This is pretty basic stuff they teach on schools, but schools are for capitalist pigs, right


Well, let's deal with these in descending order.
First off: nobody here has said the USSR was the worst country ever made. I'd give that honor to something far predating the USSR. Mesopotamia? If you mean recent country, in standards of living terms it's still not in the bottom tiers. I'd place it above various african countries. But I digress. You're quoting things that nobody said.
Second: Just because something was said during a time of war/tension doesn't mean it's fake news. If that's true, this whole thread is a lie because I live in the US and the US is at war with Afghanistan, which was NEAR THE SOVIET UNION ERMAGHERD CUE THE ILLUMINATI MUSIC
Third: Claims that the USSR was more developed is pretty bullshit. Here's a graph.
https://ourworldindata.org/human-development-index
OECD stands for Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development and it includes North America and Europe. I had to google it too, don't worry.
In 1950 the OECD had an average HDI of .42 while eastern europe/russia had .34. That's a stark difference. (For reference, the gap between russia and the next highest region, latin america was also the same size). The gap between the two regions never really got smaller, rather, it stayed about the same for a while before russia began falling due to the collapse of the soviets. As of 2007 the gap was .81 to .54.
At the time, the HDI of .34 was quite good. As of 2015, the lowest HDI of literally any country in the world is .348, and that's Niger.
In fact, according to the table I found (which I sadly cannot find the link to anymore, but it actually having info ends up beating what you're given us so far), the Russian Federation has an HDI of .798, which ties for 50th with Belarus. As for higher HDIs, well, the U.S. is #8, the UK is #14, Japan is #20, France is #22, and Italy is #27. Interestingly, all three of the Baltic countries have a higher HDI than russia, with the lowest being Latvia at #46 (disclaimer, these numbers were up to date as of 2015). So saying that the USA "lost" the cold war is incorrect at best.
EDIT: I found the video I mentioned in the last thread! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8LtQhIQ2AE
Your waffle maker story is great btw, although it's quite irrelevant.
[/COLOR]

Well, referring back to the HDI table, china clocks in at #90. The reason China has such high amounts of industry is that it lacks proper education. Most chinese cannot afford to have higher education. Only 27% of chinese citizens actually enroll in tertiary level schooling (think universities) vs the State's 94%.
I found where you got the statement about the Chinese having higher average IQs than Americans, since you didn't actually bother to cite it. While it is true (partially, the average is actually exactly 105, not higher), they're also only #4. The countries they lose to are all Democracies. I think it speaks more to the trend that Asians in general have higher IQ than white-majority countries. But not by a significant margin as you state. The US has an average IQ of 98, while Russia comes in at 97.
Table found at https://iq-research.info/en/average-iq-by-country for those who care to check and draw your own conclusions.
The rest of your points aren't even worth responding to.


The acronym is DPRK, not KNDR. Not sure where you heard that.
Your goading comments about the USA not going to war against Korea cannot be answered by me, although my best guess would be the innocent civillians not having actually done anything wrong.
Anyway, I won't even bother answering this portion because I found an Ask-Me-Anything by a North Korean defector who pretty much says the opposite of every point you bring up here. https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/76mm7p/i_am_a_north_korean_defector_who_was_trafficked/


Well, if my assumption is right, and that you actually live in Russia or one of it's neighboring countries (based on your waffle maker story) you might want to take some new English classes but that's beside the point.
The issue is that there really haven't been any "leaders without dirty thoughts" as you so ineloquently put it when it comes to communist countries. Joseph Stalin led a war against Finland (where they actually got slapped around quite a bit lol), Fidel Castro led to the eventual decline of Cuba, the Kim dynasty spreads its own propaganda and is on complete military lockdown, and China has one of the lowest education rates for a country with its HDI.


I actually have no fucking clue where you found any of these facts. Please let me know how you determined Russia to have the 5th worst economy and the USSR to have the 2nd best. Or don't. Some good giggles for me either way.

Russian rouble is cheaper, than Gambian dalasi.
How that country can have great economics?

Stealthbomber16
April 18th, 2018, 06:48 AM
Russian rouble is cheaper, than Gambian dalasi.
How that country can have great economics?

That’s the only thing you got from this? Nohing referencing any of the actual points I brought up? Just Gambia?

Marshmallow Marshall
April 21st, 2018, 02:55 PM
Modern Russia 5th worst economy in the whole world. XDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXD XDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXD look at most African countries. Lol... That guy doesn't know what he's saying.

Fury
April 21st, 2018, 04:16 PM
From ancient history to now, it's been proven that great leaders can be one of the sole driving forces in making a country amazing. The issue is the roll of the dice.

Since communism focuses its power in the select few who rule (in practice), conditions could be utter shit with a bad ruling elite.

Cuba, North Korea, China (more so before the last decade of change), and Italy (Facist, but similar to communist) were all awful examples.

I'm not going to fight against your example of Russia, as you seem very pro-USSR. But, even if I were to concede Russia as a good example, then it would not mean communism is good.

One good example of a communist country is not enough to say communism alone is good. Indeed, having only one good example (out of many) means that it is worse.

Stealthbomber16
April 21st, 2018, 05:17 PM
Modern Russia 5th worst economy in the whole world. XDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXD XDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXDXD look at most African countries. Lol... That guy doesn't know what he's saying.

Venezuela’s currency currently is worth less than world of Warcraft gold.

tsc2077
October 19th, 2018, 05:14 PM
China does well because they have a billion people working more or less as slave labor. many companies give housing and board to workers that requires most of their income to afford. slave labor lets you get alot of trade. its not really a communist thing or reason. USSR was different. a great quote is that people pretended to work and the government pretended to pay them. USSR was successfull for a time due to the cold war but economic collapse was inevitable. communism doesnt correct its economy like capitalism does. its a good system until it isnt. then its worse than capitalism could ever be. doesnt help that communism as its used doesnt really offer freedom or oppertunity.

Mugy
October 20th, 2018, 08:45 AM
This discussion is bizarre as it's assuming "communist" states are even communist.

China isn't actually communist, it's just a name.
Same for the USSR as far as I know.

yzb25
October 20th, 2018, 10:34 AM
lol reds

Ganelon
October 20th, 2018, 10:38 AM
This discussion is bizarre as it's assuming "communist" states are even communist.

China isn't actually communist, it's just a name.
Same for the USSR as far as I know.
So what's a communist state then?

Arsonist
October 21st, 2018, 05:19 AM
China does well because they have a billion people working more or less as slave labor. many companies give housing and board to workers that requires most of their income to afford. slave labor lets you get alot of trade. its not really a communist thing or reason. USSR was different. a great quote is that people pretended to work and the government pretended to pay them. USSR was successfull for a time due to the cold war but economic collapse was inevitable. communism doesnt correct its economy like capitalism does. its a good system until it isnt. then its worse than capitalism could ever be. doesnt help that communism as its used doesnt really offer freedom or oppertunity.

Are necroposts THAT necessary?

Ganelon
October 21st, 2018, 05:23 AM
Are necroposts THAT necessary?
You necropsy all the time, why do you have a problem with this thread being necroed?

Arsonist
October 21st, 2018, 05:27 AM
You necropsy all the time, why do you have a problem with this thread being necroed?

It's not good thread

Mugy
October 21st, 2018, 06:16 AM
So what's a communist state then?

A state that implements communist ideology? China is capitalism incarnate.