Theme & Set-up (inspired by DRs Christian FM): Counter Strike Mafia!

[Dimwit]

I know I'm ignorant to whatever the process for forum mafia hosting and theme is, but I had this idea that I thought was fantastic and is heavily inspired (obviously) by Dark.Rev's "Christian Mafia". There are just as many differences as similarities, however.

I call it "Counter-Strike Mafia". The balance is a little sketchy, but can be tweaked. The game starts slow on night kills intentionally to allow the invest roles to gather a little bit of information before shit goes all crazy. I've also introduced a mechanic I call "inherent alliance".

Terrorists(Faction)
Win Conditions: See all Anti-Terrorists(Faction) perish.

Auckbar - Terrorist Recruiter and Leader
Each night can choose one player to attempt to recruit; if recruitment is succesfull, ability is on cooldown for one night.
Can override the kill target of a killing role, if one has been recruited.
Is Immune to night kills and shows as a Anti-Terrorist to Sheriff as long as John Smith survives.

John Smith - Bomb Technician
Can use a total of 2~3 terrorist recruits as Suicide bombs.
Suicide Bombs blow up their target and anyone who visits the target as well as whom the target visits. If the target is Anti-Terrorist, a random non-immune anti-terrorist will also perish.


Anti-Terrorists(Faction)
Win Conditions - See all Terrorists(Faction) Perish
May not have more than 5 anti-terrorists at one time.

Mayhem - Recruiter
Each night can choose one player to attempt to recruit; if recruitment is succesfull, ability is on cooldown for one night.
Is also present for interrogations(jail).
Is Immune to night Kills and shows as Civilian to Investigator as long as Brad survives.

Brad - Jailor/Vigilante
If no lynch occurs, can choose to Jail a player. Jailer execution pierces immunity.
If there is a lynch, Brad is a simple Vigilante at night. Vigilante shot does NOT pierce immunity.
Can attempt to kill a maximum of 3~4 times.

Richard Seymore Scottman - Senator(Mayor)
Can self reveal during day; votes count as 1/5 living players (rounded)
Once revealed, cannot be healed.


Civilians(Pre-Faction)
Win conditions dependant on inherant alliance. Inherant alliance is the faction for which the player is capable to be recruited to. If a player has not been recruited at the end of the game, if still alive the player will win with their inherent alliance.

Sheriff - Anti-Terrorists
Each night, check to see aplayers inherent alliances or faction.

Private Investigater - Terrorists
Check for a player's role each night.

Escort - Terrorist/Anti-Terrorist
Role block a player each night

Medic - Anti-Terrorist
Can heal a target each night

Mentally Unstable Individual - Terrorist
Once recruited, can target one person to kill each night.
Shows as a anti-terrorist to sheriff until recruited.

Informant - Terrorist/Anti-Terrorist
Shows as civilian.
If recruited to either faction, will be allowed to send a total of 2 size limited messages to the leader of the opposing faction; Neither player will inharently discover the identity of the other.
If recruited, Wins with opposing faction.

Lurker (Lookout) - Anti-terrorist
Each night can see all players that visit the Lurker's target.

Snoop (Detective) - Terrorist
Each night can track a single players movements.

Civilian - Anti-Terrorist (non-recruitable)
Wins with Anti-Terrorists.

[BorkBot]

Looks quite interesting, and the inherent alliances definitely help to establish a more strongly specified direction that doesn't rely on an enormous amount of neutrals who are all picking their noses until the "cool guy groups" start to reveal themselves. Only to switch sides whenever it's convenient.

On the other hand, it seems really hard to predict how things may turn out, so it's still going to be difficult to get the balance right. I'd expect the anti-terrorists to take the lead early on by an early sheriff reveal. The terrorists rely heavily on an early investigator recruit and might not be able to kill anyone for some time. Investigators can't share their information openly because they will be jailed and killed if they do.

[TheWaaagh]

The only problem I can see with it right now is that Civilians not being recruited means they'll likely not contribute at all, and just bandwagon votes. Since they have to survive to win, it only makes sense for them to not draw any attention at all (and it's not like standing out could get them recruited, so why bother?). And if you're only goal in a game is "shut up and not die" it gets incredibly boring. Other than that it looks cool.

[Luna]

Hmm, as far as I can see this is still just Town vs. Mafia, only the Mafia have extra members not in night chat and the Town have some power roles pre-masoned.

I don't know why I bothered wording it like that actually. It's Town versus Town, except one Town can kill more than the other Town.

You have to define the win conditions for the (Pre-Faction) Citizens. If they die without having been converted, they lose, and if they survive they can only win with one faction? All that does is screw over the dead people, as far as I can see there's not much point to this 'inherent alliance' system - it'd be much fairer to scrap it and just fully align the roles with one faction or another.

And so what you have created is a two-faction game, but instead of 3 or 4 mafia against the Town it's a 50/50 split (with a couple of neutrals). I think a setup like that could work, but only if it's approached that way from the ground up. Approaching it like this with a big 'neutral' group which isn't neutral at all is quite messy. Tbh Day 1 all the Anti-Terrorists can role-claim, then force a lynch with their mayor or get the jailor and vigilante to anonymously kill.

Someone else had a similar idea to this, I forget. Anyway, their setup was what yours is hinting at; essentially it's Town + Mafia vs. Town + Mafia. At least do something like that, because it just sucks for the Civilians in this setup (they're forced into helping one faction, but if they die they can't win with them :S)

[Dimwit]

I should have made it clearer: civilians(role) win in death as well. That's why it might look repititiius saying that under there discription. Ill fix that when I get home.

[Nick]

Instead of neutrality, civilians will hang around until they are recruited. But in the meantime they will push for the victory of their own factions?

But if the votes are split about 50-50 (maybe) lynches will be a drag. Idea is good. How about the balance - number of players, role distribution?

[Dimwit]

I'm home now, so I'll be able to make this more clear. Also, if I come off defensive, it's nothing personal, it's a personality trait. I honestly take no issue with ANY criticism tossed at me; it's quite welcome.

Firstly, most of the criticism appears to stem from a miscommunication on my part. Citizens, even in death, win with anti-terroists.


On the other hand, it seems really hard to predict how things may turn out, so it's still going to be difficult to get the balance right.

It's hard to predict the turn-out of any mafia game, but I get your point. That's why I started with a 50/50 split of the shear number of roles on each side (without civilians). With the killing roles mostly stacked on the Terrorist faction (inspired by my own SC2 Mafia set-ups), and defensive players on the Anti-Terrorist faction, it lopsided the Terrorists a bit, which is why Civilians are Anti-Terrorists, to even up the kill count. Of course, even the kill count is entirely unpredictable with the Bomb Technician and could reach rather high, the effect of which is very dependent on total players.


I'd expect the anti-terrorists to take the lead early on by an early sheriff reveal. The terrorists rely heavily on an early investigator recruit and might not be able to kill anyone for some time. Investigators can't share their information openly because they will be jailed and killed if they do.

I get what you're saying here, but I think you miss some of my intent.

For one, I intended that it would take a few days for the terrorists to starting getting in some solid kill numbers. This was so everyone could enjoy their role before getting a random bullet to the back and also allow them to gather some base intelligence before heads started to explode.

With there being both a Sheriff and Invest working against each other, it encourages that both of them actually think of how they might want to reveal information before being recruited if it is that necessary to share with the class to help their faction. It makes every bit of intel sharing a gambit before being recruited.

Although you do have a good point on the Terrorists relying on an invest, both factions are going to rely on finding an investigator for an accurate shot at killing the correct targets. It applies to both.


And so what you have created is a two-faction game, but instead of 3 or 4 mafia against the Town it's a 50/50 split (with a couple of neutrals). I think a setup like that could work, but only if it's approached that way from the ground up. Approaching it like this with a big 'neutral' group which isn't neutral at all is quite messy. Tbh Day 1 all the Anti-Terrorists can role-claim, then force a lynch with their mayor or get the jailor and vigilante to anonymously kill.

I don't believe that a mass role-claim is any different here than anywhere else.

The set-up is to encourage a cost vs reward on public intel sharing and role claiming from day 1. You might have found the Bomb Technician on night 2, but you're likely to wait a few days or to recruitment to attempt to share the information as you're death before recruitment results in a loss, yet you already have one of the final pieces to the puzzle.

This falls directly into symbiosis with the delay on killings at the start of the game.


Instead of neutrality, civilians will hang around until they are recruited. But in the meantime they will push for the victory of their own factions?

Pretty much, yes.



But if the votes are split about 50-50 (maybe) lynches will be a drag. Idea is good. How about the balance - number of players, role distribution?

There will absolutely be more Anti-Terrorists than Terrorists. Mostly due to Civilians.

For 1 mentally-unstable individual, there should be 2 Medics; with 2 assassins, there should be at least 3 medics. This is partially due to balancing the fact that (which I will make clear in the OP) the Bomb Technician negates the effect of a heal and also kills the healer.

Sheriff vs Invest and Lurker vs Snoop will be an even 1/1, 2/2 or 3/3. The escort and informant will also add a bit of variability.

So all in all, in a setup with 30 it would be something like:
18 Anti-terrorists
8 Terrorists
4 Variable anti/terrorist

Broken Down:
3 default anti-terrorists
7 inherent PR Anti-terrorists
8 Civilians

2 Default Terrorists
6 inherent PR terrorists

4 Variable anti/terrorist

All of this balanced with a potentially high kill count by the terrorist faction. I think with 30 players, the Bomb Technician would get 3 suicide bombs. But also remember that a suicide bomb is sacrificing a power role for a shot at a gnarly chain kill but possibly a bust.