specials are hidden when the role is from random

[anemoneya]

topic sounds little silly. i'll elaborate little more here.
Currently, the help section only shows list of non-random roles and their specials.
Things get nasty when the randomed role is the only role present in game and the setting for that role is unusual.
It's somewhat host's fault for making unusual setting but here's example:

there was Random neutral and some players figured out he's Serial killer and made plan to nail him down.
The plan went really wrong and SK won because....it turned out that "SK is invulnerable at night" option was on!! But help section didn't list SK and SK's specials because no SK except random SK was there. It sucks because not only his role was hidden, his perks were hidden also.

There's two solution to this...1. everyone should look carefully when host set up stuff, but it's easy to miss and impossible to notice if host uses saved setting

2. ideally, HELP section should list ALL roles and their perks if there is random role.

[Dark.Revenant]

Do you have any idea how long the help menu would be?

The solution is a big database of all the roles. However, that will take a very, very VERY VERY long time to do. And I can't even get a 1KB bank to work.

[McJesus]

you could just put the selected options on the possible roles...

ie: if there is a random neutral and serial killer has the selected option on to kill roleblockers say something like "serial killer kills roleblockers" in the random neutral description.

I think that would probably easier but I'm not a programmer so I don't know.

[Dark.Revenant]

None of the options are ever easy.

[Membrax]

Personally, as host using saved variant, I try to always show role settings before game start while people give their recommendations.
If people go custom, most times you see clearly what the options are, and if not, I'd expect standard options.
Now if for whatever reasons you still don't know, well, shit happens ;)

[anemoneya]

If you don't want help section to be too long,
then over time (not right now, you must be really tired from fixing bank), you could add in-game script where people can type

-role Serial Killer
and output be
-can kill at night
-is invulnurable at night
-can kill roleblocker

I know it's some work, but I think it's excellent feature to add in the future.

This is really needed feature as there are some popular variations like "god father is immune to detection" "god father can't kill" "sk kill roleblocker" "bullet proof vest" and those roles often result from random mafia or any other random roles. It's hard to make deductions on someone's role or strategy when you don't know specific roles specials. Assuming their role to have default option is often safe but the outcome will often be devastating if it turns out that they were not default.

[Membrax]

Totally forgot about in-game scripts even though I'm a compulsive "last will" user !
Excellent idea 8)
Possible shortcuts could be -mafia, -neutral, -town, - variant, etc...

[anemoneya]

yeah, I would like this feature near future.
For now, if host wanted, it could give a lot of advantage using saved custom setting because only he would know true abilities of each roles.

[Dark.Revenant]

A chat-window display wouldn't work for technical reasons I don't want to go into. I wish I could just add some more fucking pages to the Help menu; there would be no issue if I could do that.

[Ttobbattam]

Personally, I actually think that that kind of scenario is one of the things I like about random roles; total anonymity. The fact that you can't tell whether or not the SK has certain abilities, or any other selected role, is part of what I like about random roles.

[anemoneya]

Personally, I actually think that that kind of scenario is one of the things I like about random roles; total anonymity. The fact that you can't tell whether or not the SK has certain abilities, or any other selected role, is part of what I like about random roles.


but host knows it and that's unfair

[Kaldra]

Either A. pay attention to the host setting up the game or B. if he's using a saved settings, just ask the host if invulnerable is on before the game starts.

[Dark.Revenant]

You do realize I added "tutorial" pages in the help menu containing the role-box information about every possible role?

[Clawtrocity]

That's not in the most recent live version Dark. At least not on the American servers.

[Dark.Revenant]

Oh fuck, I've been working on 1.21 so long that features in that version run together with the regular version.